#61

@scta123 do you get that from your breathing exercises too?

What type of breathing exercises has been best for HRV?

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#62

Thx. I noticed the third device, but did not check it. Seems interesting. Neurosym is really expensive even with 10% off.

Morning readings mostly depend on how well I slept. And I sleep usually better when I do yoga before bed that includes breathing relaxation. But did not keep a record, I measure my HRV with apple watch continuously in the background and it really reflects how physically tired I am.

I think the best and most simple breathing exercise is ā€œocean breathingā€, when your inhale and exhale is about 5 seconds long and breathing sounds somehow like a distant ocean waves.

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#63

My sleep results and morning HRV readings and overnight HRV readings are improving because of a large effort I am putting toward sleep. Pulsetto was a one-off add-on that seemed likely to help without requiring too much extra effort.

The main problem with sleep improvement is that sleeping well in alignment with a circadian rhythm is a skill (or set of skills). Doing a lot of things which are contrary to good sleep are also skills (that were once highly valued but now are not). Early in my adult life I learned through trial and error, and constant practice over many years to: stay up late to have fun and to keep working as needed, get up early to get to the office early / the ski lift early / beat the afternoon storms / etc., to not be sleepy even when sleep deprived. I became very good at this. Now I struggle to unlearn these skills.

I also struggle to learn the new skills. I want better health and sleep but I havenā€™t wanted to change my life to get it until now. For the last 20 years I have been able to cheat my body with chemicals to fall asleep when I want, and wake up when I want, and stay alert when I want, and get relaxation when I want. The chemical approach stopped working reliably about 5 years ago, so I tried better chemicalsā€¦more chemicals. Then I added non-chemical interventions that didnā€™t interfere with my life too much: bright lights in the morning, walks in the morning sunshine, dim lights in the house in the evenings. These solutions postponed the inevitable recognition that I had to change. I had to want to change my life to get the life I wanted.

I have started down this path. I am doing breathing drills with HRV biofeedback (Elite HRV app) for 20 minutes every night (Iā€™ll add in the AM soon). I tried doing meditation for 20 minutes but Iā€™m not ready for that yet. I absolutely need to learn to let my thoughts go but I need to work up to that level of skill. I have altered my workout schedule, my sleep schedule, my eating schedule. I no longer take any chemicals at night. The improvements in my sleep have come quickly but I am prone to falling back into my old, bad behaviors (which I like) so this will be a long road.

Pulsetto is a nice tool that seems to help. But it also acts as a reminder of what is important. The fact that it is uncomfortable (on a high setting) probably increases the placebo effect. I can use all the help I can get.

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#64

I canā€™t do it too. It is really hard for my mind to stay with the body, breathingā€¦ but I try small steps, few minutes. Maybe someday few minutes will become 20 or 30 :sweat_smile:

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#65

I think you are right to do what you can, and then get better over time. Consistency is the key, I believe. But form is more important than time. I have to get over thinking that my thoughts are so important that I cannot ignore them. I just donā€™t believe it yet.

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#66

I got their customer service response re the caps: caps were used for previous versions and did not perform well so they got rid of them. The manual though was not edited per this change.

Re the smell, they donā€™t know what it is, but assured me that the Pulsetto I received is new (I somehow doubt).

I used it three times on the setting 1 and 2. Each time the HRV increases 10 points. The average daily HR V also increased 10 points.

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#67

FYI. Pulsetto is running another sale. I am not affiliated but am getting marketing emails now that I am a customer

$199. Onetime purchase.

I use mine every night before bed. I like it very much.

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#68

@Joseph_Lavelle Have you seen a measurable increase of the nightly HRV with some wearable?

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#69

@cl-user My sleep HRV has improved dramatically over the last few weeks due to several things I have started, including Pulsetto. I canā€™t claim Pulsetto has made any difference for certain but I have found it is a great signal to my body and brain that I am transitioning to sleep. I now do not take any chemicals before bed, and I always feel sleepy and fall asleep with little trouble. And now I am able to either sleep through the night or fall back asleep with little or zero trouble when I do have to use the bathroom. My sleep duration is slowly creeping up but I never have a terrible night anymore.

Wind down

  • early dinner or low fat/low fiber dinner
  • no supplements
  • roller / stretching
  • Pulsetto for 10 minutes on level 9 (ouch)
  • HRV biofeedback for 10-20 minutes (working up to 20m x 2 per day)
  • dim lights / red lights in bathroom
  • moved my cardio workouts to AM
  • trying to move my resistance training to AM
  • listening to relaxing music after workouts (instead of podcasts)
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#70

After about 10 days with Pulsetto (and no other large real positive changes, though perhaps negative one in that I moved house), Iā€™ve seen

  • An improvement of nighttime/morning HRV (around 10% measured with both Whoop and Oura) saw that improvement the first night
  • My night time HR may have gone down by a beat or two
  • my respiratory rate too I think (@Joseph_Lavelle did you see that continue for you?)

I think Iā€™m calmer and less phases by tress and qualitatively think Iā€™m better rested.

My initial protocol was generally

  • 6 min of anti stress model in the morning/before lunch (level 7-8)
  • same as above + 12 min of sleep mode in the evening (level 8)

Iā€™ve now started to cut out the morning session, and think I still retain most of the effects (note I also do a session of Transcendental Medication ā„¢, that Iā€™ve done for more than a decade).

The one thing that is a bit extra cumbersome is the gel that one applied before each session, but now that Iā€™m doing it once a day instead of two a worry less about that.

@AnUser did Oliver/Bryan talk anything about HRV and the vagues nerve stimulators that they have been using yesterday?

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#71

@LaraPo and @Joseph how has your experience been with the Pulsetto? Have you used it for a while now, any pros or cons that you are experiencing?

#72

I donā€™t remember that, the admins forgot to record the talk but next one will be recorded.

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#73

ok, thx. any thoughts yourself, in Europe you seem to also be able to get the Neurosym - my understanding is that Bryan used both.

#74

I havenā€™t paid any attention, I am at level zero. If I do learn anything and if I remember it Iā€™ll post here much later.

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#75

I noticed that if I use it before going to sleep, I have difficult time falling asleep. Seems it energizes me instead of relaxing.

My HRV goes up some 10 points and then falls back to usual.

At this point no any noticeable benefits.

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#76

@Neo No, my breathing rate did not stay low. I had only the one night (the first night) with a breathing rate about 1 bpm less than normal. Iā€™m at the bottom of the normal range (12-20), so maybe thatā€™s why Iā€™m not getting a sustained benefit. Iā€™m also lifting at night 3x/week.

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#77

I use and recommend this product: easy to use and plenty of output detail.

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#78

Have you seen the impact of this on your over night sleep metrics, especially including HRV, or are you (just) talking about realtime/concurrent increase?

(As mentioned above I have meditated daily for a decade and that was in my baseline night time HRV numbers, for me the vagus nerve stimulation seems to be having additive events on top of that - and not just for a few minutes but impacting my averages across the whole nights of sleep)

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#79

I donā€™t do it consistently enough most of the time. But Since 10 days+ after noticing my BP rises when I get to work I started with breathing exercises everyday. Seems that it has some improvement on metrics beyond immediate effect on HRV. My average BP dropped 3 points (24h average 115/70 dropped to 112/67), my total sleep increased 15 minutes (from 7.15 to 7.30) and my HRV increased from 52 to 57 (weekly average). But I want to be more consistent and track it longer to call it.
I am doing breathing exercises 10 minutes every morning and every evening.

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#80

Iā€™d guess every little bit helps. I think of it like this: I get nearly continuous stimulation of my sympathetic ANS. My body has come to assume that I need to be on alert all the time. Anything I can add to the parasympathetic side of the scale is going to help retrain my brain to be more in balance. Once I get back in balance, I wonā€™t need daily retraining but will still need to offset the sympathetic onslaught.

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