Dr. Miller said the ITP is limiting combinations as it’s too hard to tease out the data on which supplement is really extending life. You probably won’t see more than 3 drugs/interventions from the ITP at the same time. And that would be very rare even if it happens.
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Re. the “in food everything gets mixed up anyway” comment. Yes, mixed meals is carbs, fat, protein do get mixed up. An issue to consider is as we age we develop sarcopenia ( muscle wasting) from our midlife on due to anabolic resistance to stimuli of food any excercise training. This leaves us weaker and frail over time. Insulin resistance doesn’t help either. So mixing meals isn’t always great. Perhaps blindly mixing supps isn’t either. Btw, rapamycin can help with the muscle wasting protein synthesis by influencing mTor. Food for thoughts?
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AJD
#106
LDL is actually the only one that matters for cardiovascular risk. Usually when people have high cholesterol, the concern is really with LDL. The goal is to lower it. HDL is of less concern, and tends to rise with exercise. This is a nice simple chart to reference for LDL levels.
(from the Cleveland Clinic)
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Curious how you get your NR, if you don’t mind my asking. From everything I’ve read the commercial/retail supplement supplies of NMN and NR don’t often turn up as having these compounds when tested because they both degrade so quickly. Even David Sinclair often discusses this and claims he himself has access to laboratory NMN at Harvard (but I think one of his companies are trying to make their own patented NMN analogue so there’s that….). Then again, Walmart can keep nicotine patches in its stock for years. So am I missing something? - am I confusing the zero shelf life of NMN with NR? Am I correct but you have a good supplier?
You are obviously getting something active because you actively feel it working (I’m not convinced the placebo works over the long term). At 56 (young or old) you feel it has a strong positive effect?
Also, you do regular three-day fasts? (I just finished a four day fast yesterday). You take all your supplements on your fasts? — I did this time as well (including 30 carbs with of unsweetened dark chocolate cocoa and 20g of collagen in my coffee) but felt guilty.
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Im not entirely sure that for athletes this is what is going on: yes, LDL is a major risk factor in CVD (particularly ASCVD), but I’ve seen many studies that suggest very heavy endurance athletes (in particular) create too much stress on their cardiovascular system. Exercise is stress and is great for you to cause your body to react and rebuild tissue and build muscle, but the response appears to have a U-shaped dose response — too much stress (with consistently high blood pressure over long periods such as with endurance athletes) appears to cause stress response in blood vessels.
This definitely isn’t the answer I want to hear: it pisses me off that we can’t “work our way out” of old age with hard work and massive consistent exercise: it must be dosed.
(Again, not arguing LDL is a risk factor).
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AJD
#109
Lol. I certainly commiserate with your feelings about not being able to use pure grit to overcome this inevitable human reality.
With respect to that sort of U-curve you’ve described, you may be right. Although, one of the interesting things to look at with respect to that would be the longitudinal data on athlete mortality. I certainly don’t have that information.
I was a competitive endurance athlete for most of my life until the last 5 years. And, so far, I don’t have any organic health issues that would indicate anything you’ve described. All of my ailments have been primarily musculoskeletal not cardiovascular, with the exception of neurological issues–most of which were also related to musculoskeletal injuries in my spine. The singular exception is Bell’s palsy which has been a very big crucible for the last 18 months.
But, my goal was simply to answer the question about LDL cholesterol and whether it being high is problematic.
Interestingly, while I was looking for that chart, I ran across multiple studies indicating a similar u-curve about HDL cholesterol except it is inverted. So, low HDL is a significant cardiovascular risk factor, and high HDL relative to LDL is protective against heart disease, but very high HDL is a risk factor for all-cause death.
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I believe it is a pure case that too much of anything good is still too much, whether exercising or overdosing on supplements. The problem I have is knowing which ones to back off of as, by all accounts, I’m in optimum health according to: Elevate Your Health and Longevity with Bauman Performance
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LukeMV
#111
I think many of you are too pessimistic that positive benefits will turn to negatives as soon as things start getting combined.
I actually think the opposite is more likely. That most combinations will be additive (to a point).
We have already seen many things combined show more benefit (ex: Rapamycin/acarbose, NAC/glycine, statin/ezetimibe, coq10/selenium, stacking BP meds, etc).
The fact so many things that I listed above showed extra benefit tells me it’s more likely combos will be more synergistic instead of antagonistic.
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Some things are synergistic and multiplicative. Some are additive. Some are neutral. Some are detrimental. Just look at the C. Elegans graph above and you can determine a rough percentage for each.
Of the 23 interventions that had positive improvements, only 2 had negative effects when combined with Metformin. The problem is when you start adding more.
14 interventions had positive additive results. A few were amazing.
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Here is an recent clip where Brian Kennedy talks about combining longevity interventions.
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J0hn
#115
You know what really gets my goat about Ora, is they show amazing graphs, but won’t give any information about what the drugs are.
What is the point in doing the experiment and not fully reporting the data. It’s just so wrong 
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For C. Elegans, Metformin works consistently and reproducibily well at extending lifespan. In the graph above, the red Metformin bar is always positive.
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LukeMV
#117
Ah you’re right. I was thinking of humans. Ignore what I said
