#226
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#227

Now brand wins again, in case you don’t want to watch the whole thing. A penny a milligram. This is not really for the high dose people, including me. I take 24mg/night. Most of these are around 3.

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#228

That’s a gold mine! Thank you

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#229

Desertcart sells a v wide range of melatonin

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#230

This is 20mg X 365 tablets 7300 milligrams for USD 21.99 about a third of a cent per gram.

This

Ends up at about GBP 100 for 350 grams. That is about a 30th of a cent per gram.

I have bought some of the bioven powder and intend testing it out.

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#231

I’ve been taking the 4th place one, natures bounty which is fairly cheap.

I haven’t read anything on the difference between synthetic and non synthetic melatonin. In vitamins, taking synthetic versions can be iffy, I’m going to assume that synthetic melatonin is fairly bio safe.

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#232

The plant based melatonin makers would like to have a word. I have no idea but they talk about how the synthetic manufacturing process introduces unhealthy features and the other chemicals added to most melatonin supplements can also create problems for sensitive people. I take a synthetic version now but I am looking at the other ingredients with a cautious eye.

#233

Just as an experiment, I challenge doubters to take a large dose of melatonin on waking.
They will see that it does not affect daytime sleepiness unless they are subjectively pre-biased that it will.
Why large doses?
One reason is the effect of melatonin on phase separation, which is a currently evolving science.

“Melatonin’s Protective Effects: Melatonin has been shown to have neuroprotective effects, possibly by reducing oxidative stress and modulating protein aggregation. This suggests that melatonin may influence phase separation processes involved in protein aggregation and neurodegeneration.”

“Potential Therapeutic Implications: Understanding how melatonin influences phase separation processes could have therapeutic implications for diseases associated with dysregulated phase separation, such as neurodegenerative diseases and cancer.”

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#234

Is anyone else here supplementing with transdermal melatonin? I experimented with high oral doses in the form of 250mg powder twice daily, in the morning and before bed but I noticed increased periods of drowsiness. For the last couple of weeks I have changed my routine to a transdermal lotion based approach which I use before bed. I mixed the melatonin powder into a moisturizing cream and apply it to may face, neck, shoulders and arms; basically the body parts most exposed to the sun.

Oral melatonin is only 15% bioavailable, transdermal is at least 70% so I reduced the dose to approximately 100mg and I only use the single dose before bed. Oral melatonin is only active for about an hour, transdermal lasts up to 8 hours with a slow release. Interestingly melatonin is also an mTor agonist.

So far so good, I’m getting great sleep quality and noticeable skin improvements. The skin improvements are certainly helped by the lotion itself but there are many research papers on melatonin and skin health. The very high dose melatonin is also getting into my general circulatory system so I’m hoping that all the organs are getting some benefit.

Here are a couple of related studies:

Protective Role of Melatonin and Its Metabolites in Skin Aging

Clinical Studies Using Topical Melatonin

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#235

I used a melatonin cream for years. I mixed the melatonin in my cream, also pretty high doses. Never noticed any effects at all: not on skin, also not on sleep. Whereas when I take it orally it does seem to help with sleep (albeit not consistently). I’ve mixed melatonin in a store bought cream, also in a cream I made myself with transcutol among others. No difference, no observable effects for me.

#236

How exactly are you defining transdermal here. My impression of “transdermal” is typically a patch type of system; have you created a metformin patch of some sort?. Or are you just defining transdermal as a topical lotion formulation?

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#237

I have no idea if there is a technically accurate term for putting it on your skin and letting it soak in, I’ve heard “topical” and “transdermal” used. As I said in the post I mixed powdered melatonin into skin moisturizer and slathered it on. The lotion approach may allow higher concentrations on the skin while eventually providing it to the other organs over an extended time period. As also mentioned, it is also an mTor agonist.

#238

I sleep well with and without the melatonin so I can’t say how well it does helping with that. It definitely takes longer to be absorbed than oral so you would have to take it an hour or so before bed I assume. I do notice quite vivid dreams fairly often.

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#239

Hi John. Did you get the Bioven and the Nature’s Bell melatonin delivered to the UK? I can’t see that delivery option on their website. Have you tested out the Bioven Melatonin?

I’m trying to find a good source for powder or high dose capsules. I ordered some from Raw Powders but I’m not convinced of the quality. It burns the back of my throat slightly when i include it into my current night time oral solution of l theanine and mag threonate.

#240

Depends which website. There are a number that deliver to the uk.

#241

Could you mention the websites that you have tried and tested? Nature’s Bell do not deliver to the UK. I’m trying to find a reliable source. Please PM me if you don’t want to mention them here for some reason. I’d be very grateful.

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#242

They are just the normal manufacturers stock. Desertcart have a big range, but delivery can be expensive.

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#243

I’m interested to try this. Slow absorption over night seems a great idea

#244

What is the optimal dose of melatonin for neuroprotection? Is it sufficient to take a low dose- 3 mg- 5 mg, or a megadose, more than 20 mg is needed? Which dose is needed for improvement of sleep? There are different and often opposing opinions on these subjects, as was mentioned earlier on this blog.
I noticed that taking 30 mg did not help with sleep.

#245

As I have posted before, Melatonin neither causes sleep nor prolongs sleep.
Melatonin only resets the circadian rhythm or, if taken at the same time as your normal sleep cycle, augments your natural production.
As we grow older, we produce less melatonin naturally so that it might need a little boost.
It takes less than 1mg to achieve this.

As for neuroprotection, anti-cancer, and longevity benefits, I think much larger doses are required, starting with 10-20 mg at bedtime. @John_Hemming can better address this than me. I am currently taking approximately 1 gram before bedtime.
Melatonin does not prolong sleep.

If you have a problem getting a solid 7-8 hours of sleep at night, you need some other intervention.
Many of these have been addressed in the thread: “Sleep supplements: what is most effective, least habit forming, and safest?”

Not medical advice:
Two relatively safe long-term solutions that I have found are:
Doxepin and quetiapine(Seroquel) . Both are anti-depressants. I say they are relatively safe as sleep supplements because the dose required to reduce sleep onset time and extend sleep times is much lower than the amount prescribed for anti-depressant use. They are both prescribed at much higher doses for mental disorders, even for children.

From my reading, Doxepin may be the safer of the two for long-term use.

For oral dosage form (tablets)

Doxepin
For insomnia:
Adults—6 milligrams (mg) once a day.
Older adults—At first, 3 mg once a day. Your doctor may adjust your dose as needed.

Quetiapine (Seroquel)
“Baby Bear” doses (25-100 mg daily) are for sedative-hypnotic effects"

I have not tried Doxepin, but I have occasionally used quetiapine 50-10 to good effect.
Both drugs are available from India.

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