Be carefull in extrapolating the effects of (short term) lowering of salt intake to the future. As mentioned, salt is an addictive substance, this is not trivial. It is difficult to give it up and your body will try to stop you if you do. When you do, you have to go through a withdraw process which can be fatal for the elderly and metabolically impaired. For me it is always 2-3 weeks of headaches, insomnia, dreaming of salt, trying to make up excuses in my mind for why a little bit would not hurt at this point, dizziness, nausea, blood pressure spikes, gout flare ups, anxiety, … I’ve been there before and indeed, taking a little bit of salt at that point fixes everything immediately. Therefore I can see why most people and scientists would warn against drastically lowering or even quitting salt. If I where to draw blood in the withdrawal phase, I’m sure my docter would strongly advice me to stop with what I’m doing and eat more salt… But after those 3 weeks of going through withdrawal, it gets better and after a few months I don’t crave salt anymore and I’m actually disgusted by the amounts of salt in most modern foods. Now I taste the sodium in fresh tomatoes.

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Is there solid research by now that proves a no salt diet really improves different biomarkers of health?

Anecdotally, but since I see many anecdotes in this thread either way: since I was a child my BP has always been ~90/60, and recently at moments lower (~86/57). I do eat a quite restrictive whole food diet, no processed foods and I have been lowish in weight. But I certainly have always added a lot of salt - up to the point family comments on it. (It’s one of those things I have not been able to quit, given the fact my diet already feels rather restrictive).

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And, on the other hand. :grin:

As with everything diet related: it’s complicated and your milage may vary.
I’m sure there are gradients and for a lot of people salt is not a problem. Their genotype is compatibel with (ad libitum) salt. They might have other issues but salt is not one of them. For my genotype, salt seems to be a major problem.

How to tell?

  1. inability to lose weight even if your diet is dialed in. You continue overeating, even from the ‘good’ calories
  2. blood pressure keeps creeping up, especially as you age. Some pills seem to work and if your doctor finds out about your diet, he says " you should not have high blood pressure with such a good diet "
  3. (skin) auto-immune issues
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It was just the only thing that worked for my fluctuating (although not medically significant) edema/puffiness and intermittent dizziness accompanied by LOW bp. Once I decided to quit salt and let my body manage my electrolyte balance on it’s own from whatever was naturally in my diet everything stabilized. I don’t experience any of those issues anymore and feel very stable without added salt.

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image
I have this book coming through my step daughter who was able to check it out for me as a university student. I’m super excited to read it. It was close to $200 usd to purchase it so I opted for the frugal route.
I’m actually pretty stunned by how emotional people get on the subject. I’m glad we are able to discuss it here in a civilized manner.
I’m also reading Salt a World History by Mark Kurlansky right now which is really good.

I found a 10 page excerpt from the book.

You can download a lot of things from Anna’s archive.
I’m putting a link so you know what the website link is to avoid it in the future. :wink:

It definitely does not have that book, for sure.

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Thank you sir! It’s strange that the book is so hard to come by.

It’s actually there, just like a lot of books.

I’d guess junk food is the most precious thing to them. Or salting food to make it more palatable. It could be because they don’t get much positive valence from other things. A happy person doesn’t need junk food, I would guess. But meanwhile it might help them.

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@AnUser, I’m really enjoying fully tasting my food. I don’t think most people realize what they are missing. It seems like even after 6 solid months of salt my taste is improving. I somewhat noticed it I before in 2022 but I was carnivore then so the variety of tastes I experienced was much more limited.

“In addition to reporting average responses in groups of individuals, some trials have also reported the blood pressure responses of individual participants (Table 6-5). An apparent rise in blood pressure in some individuals when sodium intake is reduced has been interpreted as a pressor response, potentially as a result of an over-active renin-angiotensin-aldosterone system. However, an alternative explanation is that an apparent rise in blood pressure reflects intrinsic blood pressure variability or imprecision in blood pressure measurement. This phenomenon is illustrated by analyses of the Dietary Approaches to Stop Hypertension (DASH)-Sodium trial, which assessed blood pressure change across two points in time, separated by at least a month, when there was no change in diet or sodium level (Figure 6-2a), as well as blood pressure change when sodium was markedly reduced (Figure 6-2b) (Obarzanek et al., 2003). In both situations, there was a wide, Gaussian distribution of blood pressure change. Furthermore, the standard deviation of the distribution of change in blood pressure was similar, 8.4 versus 8.6 mm Hg, respectively, suggesting that much of the variability in blood pressure response to a reduced sodium intake (including an apparent increase in blood pressure in some individuals) results from random factors unrelated to sodium intake. A similar distribution of blood pressure changes was likewise evident in an intervention study (Miller et al., 1987) that measured blood pressure carefully and on multiple occasions pre- and postintervention (see Figure 6-3), as well as in other trials (Ruppert et al., 1991). In such studies, reports that certain individuals experienced a rise in blood pressure (Table 6-5) must be interpreted very carefully. Nonetheless, the group of individuals whose blood pressure apparently rises likely differs, on average, from the group of individuals whose blood pressure falls. Specifically, those individuals with an apparent rise in blood pressure experience a greater activation of the renin-angiotensin-aldosterone axis than those whose blood pressure falls (Egan et al., 1994; Weinberger et al., 1993a).

Ruppert and colleagues (1991) reported that while a rise in plasma renin activity and aldosterone concentration were observed in all subjects placed on a reduced sodium diet, the largest increases were observed in those whose blood pressure increased. Those who have the greatest reduction in blood pressure as a result of a reduced sodium intake appear to have a less responsive renin-angiotensin-aldosterone system (Cappuccio et al. 1997; He et al., 1998, 2001; Weinberger et al., 1993a).

Given the above considerations, an apparent rise in blood pressure in response to a reduced sodium intake cannot be used as an indicator of adequate sodium intake.
National Academies of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine. 2005. Dietary Reference Intakes for Water, Potassium, Sodium, Chloride, and Sulfate. Washington, DC: The National Academies Press. https://doi.org/10.17226/10925.”

This is the first time I’ve found anything on the topic of people who experience a blood pressure rise like I have when reducing salt. It was quite a relief because I knew it worked but it seemed I was the only one.

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Another study.

image

https://x.com/sguyenet/status/1796651041875952066

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The first study was not blinded and the salt substitute group was instructed to consume less salt substitute than they normally consumed salt (with no similar instruction given to the control group) and they did not even measure the actual salt consumption of either group.

Cannot find the link of the 2nd study.

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That sounds like it is part of the intervention, so the control shouldn’t be given the same instruction.

were encouraged to use the salt substitute more sparingly, and not more frequently, than they had previously used salt to maximize the reduction in sodium achieved.

They did for what it’s worth measure sodium, and potassium in urine every 12 months.

The second study is here: Salt substitution and salt-supply restriction for lowering blood pressure in elderly care facilities: a cluster-randomized trial | Nature Medicine

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Any options on the market?

Yes, there are plenty of salt substitutes in health stores, those with reduced sodium and added potassium.

The effect in at least one of these studies seems to be mediated by the added potassium and not the reduced sodium.

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My personal experience, however, indicates that it is not too difficult to cause issues with excess potassium.

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That’s true and it was shown in the studies as well, so it should be monitored and probably not used with people that have kidney problems. These substitutes should probably reduce risk of stroke and all-cause mortality.

I think there is probably a subtle balance issue, but I have not yet worked out what it is. Obviously I continue to supplement with sodium and potassium in unusually large amounts (as well as calcium and magnesium) at the moment all the indicators seem to be going in the right direction.