Things my poor frail human body has outlived these things " born" in the same year or later than I was:
Automobiles by the millions.
A/C units by the millions.
Refrigerators by the millions.
Washing machines by the millions.
Etc, etc.
They are all dead, buried, recycled, or rusted away.
What they don’t have that I have; is the ability to self-repair.
:smile:

8 Likes

Another option for the chat part is a medical chatbot trained on medical research and published clinical trials, called evidencehunt.com. I’ve had pretty good luck with it. You have to dive in a bit to get to the chat window. First interface is a google-type page result. Answers come with links to relevant abstracts. You need an account, and are limited on the number of queries you can pose per day.

4 Likes

Just a quick update on the bedbound elderly. She has mycobacterium avium-intracelulaire (aka MAC, a very common chronic bacterial infection in the frail elderly population), and her O2 saturation is normally 82%. After each dose of rapamycin, oxygen saturation would increase to 90% for a few days, and then afterward, it will dip down to 82% again. We are increasing the dose from 0.5 mg once a week to 0.5 mg twice a week.

A review of the literature showed that mTOR has a role in mycobacterium defense.
In this paper," In the face of the increasing prevalence, high mortality, and treatment challenges associated with MAC infections, new therapeutic options are urgently needed. A promising avenue of research is that of host-directed therapies (HDTs). HDTs are adjuncts to antimicrobial therapy, differing from the latter in that they target host processes rather than the pathogen itself. The goal of HDTs is to boost protective immune responses, especially those inhibited or otherwise modified by the pathogen, and prevent excessive pathological inflammation… Rapamycin and other analogs directly inhibit mTOR activity, and vitamin D blocks upstream signaling to activate mTOR During Mycobacterium tuberculosis (Mtb) infection, the activation of both intracellular or extracellular surface pattern recognition receptors (PRRs) by certain unique Mtb-associated molecules, such as lipomannan, lipoarbinomannan, phthiocerol dimycocerosate (PDIM), lipoproteins, mycolic acid and Mtb DNA/RNA, induces autophagy . Given that autophagy plays an important role in mycobacterial clearance, and MAC can survive intracellularly by blocking phagosome-lysosome fusion, enhancing autophagy through inhibition of the mTOR pathway appears to be an attractive HDT strategy)."

Echoing this, another paper noted: Rapamycin modulates pulmonary pathology in a murine model of Mycobacterium tuberculosis infection - PubMed “In this study, we used C3HeB/FeJ mice as an experimental model to investigate the potential role of rapamycin, a mammalian target of rapamycin inhibitor, as an adjunctive therapy candidate during the treatment of Mycobacterium tuberculosis infection with moxifloxacin. We report that administration of rapamycin with or without moxifloxacin reduced infection-induced lung inflammation, and the number and size of caseating necrotic granulomas. Results from this study strengthen the potential use of rapamycin and its analogs as adjunct TB therapy, and importantly underscore the utility of the C3HeB/FeJ mouse model as a preclinical tool for evaluating host-directed therapy candidates for the treatment of TB.”

In contrast, other investigators have expressed more caution: in thie Cell article, "Therapies targeting mTOR are being explored for a number of conditions, including aging. Genetic and pharmacological mTOR inhibition can increase lifespan in yeast, worms, flies, and mice (Papadopoli et al., 2019; Saxton and Sabatini, 2017). Pilot studies of a short course of pharmacological mTOR inhibition in older human volunteers report increased responses to influenza vaccines (suggesting decreased immune senescence) and a reduction in self-reported viral respiratory infections (Mannick et al., 2014, 2018). Similarly, in lung TB patients receiving adjunctive mTOR inhibition therapy together with appropriate antimicrobial treatment had possible, transient improvement in lung function (Wallis et al., 2021). In a mouse model of severe TB, mTOR inhibition therapy induced host-beneficial or -detrimental effects depending on the treatment regimen; mTOR inhibition therapy reduced lung immunopathology in established infections when given in conjunction with an antimicrobial drug, but exacerbated lung damage and morbidity when administered alone in the early infection (Bhatt et al., 2021). Our finding that mTOR inhibitors dramatically increase susceptibility to pathogenic mycobacteria warrants caution in their use as anti-aging or immune boosting therapies in the many areas of the world with a high burden of TB."

My naive thought is that if low-dose rapamycin can strengthen the host’s immune response and rejuvenate cells, they may have a better chance of getting rid of MAC.

Feedback welcome.

6 Likes

Being smart does not mean you know what you’re talking about in areas outside of your expertise. Among these four people you mentioned, Peter Attia and Peter Diamandis are the only one’s with a broad knowledge and understanding of biology. Plenty of super smart people are clueless when it comes to health and biology because they don’t realize what they are missing. There is so much you need to understand to even know what you don’t know.

6 Likes

what I mean is that they have enormous reach and resources to the needed expertise to help them to make such a decision, If you talk about Peter Thiel and Larry Ellison. Ray Kurzweil is the father of the longevity movement.

2 Likes

I’m not sure how much we can learn from Ray Kurzweil, its hard to draw conclusions from the results of a person taking 200+ vitamins a day… without extensive pre/post testing, etc.

3 Likes

Sure they have a lot of reach, and it’s very important that they get advice from various sources and have access to more experts than some, but there is a lot of wrong advice out there and ultimately you do need to make decisions yourself on what to trust and what not to trust. As an example, Kurzweil’s longevity regimen is based on different information he got from various sources, but ultimately in the end it’s he himself that decides what information to believe and what to do and I don’t think he is anything close to an expert on that, despite being smart in other areas such as computer science. You really need deep understanding of biology to make good decisions on what to trust and he does not have that. That’s quite obvious from his predictions on longevity which are IMO ridiculous and show great lack of understanding of how complicated aging of the human body is.

2 Likes

Yep, and even if he had the deep knowledge, understanding and background in biology (which he doesn’t) to be capable of researching individual supplements sufficiently to make good decisions on which supplements to take and at what doses, there is no way in hell he has researched all these supplements he takes to any great degree unless he was researching supplements full time for years.

I have great respect for Kurzweil’s intelligence and expertise in his area, but biology is not his area.

2 Likes

Ray looks pretty good to me at 75. Not everything will come true but Ray is years ahead on many big directional things.

3 Likes

Yeah just listening to smart people because they are smart is a completely useless strategy from my own experience. The annoying ones IMO is those who think they’re right because they are smart.

Peter Diamandis somehow not falling into the keto diet or any other diet AND crushing his LDL cholesterol with a siRNA is impressive to me. Since he’s such a socialite.

1 Like

Yes, in that photo… but in others he looks 75 :wink:

RayK1

https://www.bizjournals.com/sanjose/news/2016/09/06/exclusive-google-singularity-visionary-ray.html

2 Likes

True, I have not seen him for a while so I am kind of surprised he does not look as good as some others. In the Longevity Hacker movie trailer, a lot of the “hackers” are looking great for their ages.

2 Likes

what do we think of Dave Asprey? He is on instagram a lot and always something new to share or sell :grinning:

This once again demonstrates rapa as a double edged sword. It can be a dangerous promoter of the infection when taken alone, but then helpful when combined with the antibiotics.We have to be mindful to catch any symptoms of pneumonia early.

3 Likes

It’s always welcome having a cardiologist contributor. On a totally separate topic, this study has been posted on another thread and I’d love to have your opinion.

Prevalence, Vascular Distribution, and Multiterritorial Extent of Subclinical Atherosclerosis in a Middle-Aged Cohort | Circulation (ahajournals.org)

Do you think that we should have screening using ultrasound of the general population to detect subclinical atherosclerosis , maybe as part of a physical exam? Is it in any way practical? As an internist, I have thoughts on this, but would love to hear yours.

4 Likes

Dave Asprey is a good salesman. He doesn’t understand much about health. Some of the pseudoscientific stuff he has been promoting and selling suggests to me that he is either clueless about what works for health or is outright scamming people to make money. It’s probably a bit of both.

4 Likes

First of all, you should check out this review article on their ongoing research program (https://www.jacc.org/doi/10.1016/j.jacc.2021.05.011).

Secondly, it should be pointed out that this study focused on Madrid bank employees. In fact, the principal investigator, Dr. Valentin Fuster, is the chief of cardiology at Mount Sinai in NYC. His patients are Upper East Side and European rich people. This is a very selected patient group in terms of demographic composition and socioeconomic status. For instance, their conclusions that iliofemoral plque is predictive of coronary calcium may not apply to South Asians (where PAD is rare compared to CAD), and East Asian (carotid IMT is more predictive than iliofemoral plaque for coronary calcium). And African American have different biology also (see: Racial differences in the burden of coronary artery calcium and carotid intima media thickness between Blacks and Whites - PMC)

  1. The socioeconomic status matter: because they have access to the highest level of imaging possible (such as 3D ultrasound for carotid plaque volume), and this is not available in most vascular ultrasound lab. Your neighborhood vascular ultrasound may not even tell you more basic stuff like carotid intima medial thickness or plaque grading. if there is no stenosis based on pulse wave velocity, they may just report the study as normal. In other words, the vascular ultrasound they performed for research is NOT the same as what you get in most imaging centers. These patients do not care if they spend $300 for coronary calcium scores, and to be honest, many “normal people” do not want to spend that kind of money.

  2. The question is: does it matter if we can identify silent atherosclerosis?
    The official ACC/AHA answer to this question can be found here: Coronary Artery Calcium and Multisite Atherosclerosis: Role in Risk Refinement - American College of Cardiology
    TLDR:In conclusion, while carotid IMT can provide valuable information in certain situations, its routine use as a screening tool in the general population is not currently recommended by the ACC/AHA guidelines. Decisions about the use of carotid IMT should be made on an individual basis, taking into account the patient’s overall risk profile and other relevant factors.
    The Coronary Artery Calcium (CAC) score as a useful tool for refining risk assessment in certain individuals who are at intermediate risk for cardiovascular disease. According to the 2018 ACC/AHA Guideline on the Management of Blood Cholesterol, CAC scoring can be considered for adults aged 40-75 years who do not have diabetes mellitus, who have LDL-C levels between 70-189 mg/dL, and whose 10-year atherosclerotic cardiovascular disease (ASCVD) risk is between 7.5% and 20% (intermediate risk). If the CAC score is zero, it’s recommended to withhold statin therapy unless the patient is a smoker, has a family history of premature ASCVD, or has diabetes mellitus. If the CAC score is above zero and especially if it’s 100 or more, or if it’s at or above the 75th percentile for age, sex, and ethnicity, statin therapy is recommended.

  3. Carotid IMT/plaque, DIY: I am a POCUS fanatic and I encourage you to become one too. I do POCUS on everyone everytime instead of using a stethoscope. Nowaday, pocket ultrasound such as Butterfly IQ and VScan are inexpensive. I focus on carotid because in most other studies prior, carotid plaque has higher correlation than iliofemoral plaque, and that carotid IMT/plaque is predictive of stroke. (see: https://www.asecho.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/PIIS0894731720302522.pdf)

  4. Practical CAC: Especially for the patient with middle range ASCVD score, I try to get a CAC score. If I cannot get it because of insurance or unwillingness to pay, I try to estimate CAC using carotid IMT/plaque and ASCVD risk score. Another way to get CAC score is to look at your patient’s Chest CT (e.g. for lung cancer screening or inpatient Chest CT) (see: Visual Ordinal Scoring of Coronary Artery Calcium on Contrast-Enhanced and Noncontrast Chest CT: A Retrospective Study of Diagnostic Performance and Prognostic Utility - PubMed). All you have to do: pull up the CT of the chest, locate the level where the left main/ LAD is, and start looking for coronary calcium (see Figure 1 in https://www.internationaljournalofcardiology.com/article/S0167-5273(21)01082-2/fulltext)

5 Likes

I don’t know about “we”, but from my perspective Dave Asprey is a business person pure and simple. An MBA from Wharton has probably helped him make a ton of money, but I wouldn’t believe anything he has to say about longevity drugs or supplements (many of which he happens to sell via his companies). Ultimately Dave is just getting his information from some other people who actually do the research or dive deep into the literature. I’d prefer getting close to the source of the information / studies, without the commercial influence.

6 Likes

Colchicine has recently been approved for reducing cardiovascular risk at low doses, what do you think the study and Peter Attia’s take? Would you put your mother on it if she has aortic stenosis?

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/full/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.121.056171

1 Like

Hi Jonas,

Let me start by saying I learn a lot from people like you on this board. And answering your question forced me to do a lot of reading too.

There are two trials specifically studying aortic stenosis with colchcine and there no data for aortic stenosis at this time. (Colchicine and Inflammation in Aortic Stenosis - Full Text View - ClinicalTrials.gov).

Most of the recent colchicine studies are for established coronary artery disease (e.g. in LoCoDo2, “Proven coronary artery disease; as evidenced by coronary
angiography, CT coronary angiography or a Coronary Artery Calcium Score (Agatston score >400) without CABG in last 10 years” (for full entry criteria see https://www.nejm.org/doi/suppl/10.1056/NEJMoa2021372/suppl_file/nejmoa2021372_appendix.pdf). Of note, for the sicker STEMI patients, while COLCOT (n=4745) showed cardiac risk reduction, Australian COPS trial (n=795) showed no reduction in cardiac event but increase in total death.

As Dr. Attia said, there is a “run-in” period where patients can enter the trial if they tolerate the drug. 15% of patients had to stop colchicine because they could not tolerate the medication due to GI upset, muscle pain and fatigue. Colchicine should be used cautiously in patients with renal impairment, hepatic impairment and bone marrow suppression. It should not be used “as a supplement” because of the potential risks invovled.

In practice, the drug is used in established coronary artery disease patients who are stable on other optimal medical therapies and needed additional protection. The drug requires careful monitoring and physician-patient communication during initiation.

3 Likes