#162

Dr. Greg Fahy: Thymus Regeneration & Boosting The Immune System For Longevity. He looks great for a 75-year-old.

0:00 - Introduction & Guest Introduction
2:05 - The Origins of the TRIM Protocol
6:30 - Growth Hormone & Thymus Regeneration in Rats 12:40 - Growth Hormone, Insulin Resistance & DHEA 20:10 - Why Thymus Regeneration Matters for Longevity
27:50 - Thymic Involution & Its Role in Aging 35:45 - Measuring Thymic Function & Immune Rejuvenation 42:15 - Rapamycin, Thymus, and Immune System Enhancement
50:20 - Human Trials: Thymus Regeneration & Exercise Performance 1:03:00 - The Future of Anti-Aging & Immune Restoration

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#164

Yes - I agree. A good interview with a lot of information on HGH’s history and possible issues as an anti-aging mechanism.

Of course Fahy pushes his protocol as the best.

I actually looked into it potentially a few years ago. Besides high costs… a lot of time required in testing and adhiring to a regimented program. Not for me … for a 3 year aging gain. Rapamycin is good for 20 years… just pop in the mouth… once a week. I can do that.

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#165

Just popping in to say they look like they could be the same age from that thumbnail — scary!

His protocol IS too high maintenance for my taste but there are other substitutes for HGH that boost natural HGH production and superior substitutes to metformin (sglt2i’s) that could make it interesting down the line.

When I was pregnant I got sick ALL the time and what would have been some run of the mill cold would wipe the floor with me. It’s due to the temporary thylmic involution that happens during pregnancy. To me it felt like a preview of what it’s like to be old, with an old immune system. And it’s NOT something I look forward to experiencing in daily life as my days draw to an end. So… one more bookmark in my overflowing folder….

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#166

Did he mention in the video what he saw/expects to change regarding CD4/CD8 counts (or any other immune markers)?

#167

He did. At least 10% for both. Doesn’t sound impressive, but you lose 2.5% of cd4 per year and 0.28% of cd8 per year (these percentages could be switched ) . He also said that aside from the increase in number ther would also be an increase in diversity.

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#168

It’s probably been mentioned before, but I would be curious if hgh could be replaced with the newer peptides like ioam9, tesamorelin, sermorelin, igf1-lr3 to stimulate igf1. Could be a price issue, I assume?

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#169

That’s the one I read was being used by some folks tweaking the TRIM protocol’s “open source.” In theory it should work just as well as HGH if not better.

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#170

I’ve started a modified TRIM like protocol in January, so too early to look for improvements yet.
Currently using

  • HGH 2UI/day 5days/week
  • DHEA 25m/day
  • SGLT2i (Empagliflozin 12.5mg/day) + GLP1-RA (Tirzepatide 3mg/week) instead of Metformin

When I’m out of HGH, I will switch to CJC1295-noDAC (250mcg) + Ipamorelin (400mcg) (like @Steve_Combi) instead.

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#172

What would be the purpose of using growth hormone secretagogues vs just using HGH?

#173

I imagine cheaper and … molecularly “cleaner.” Get the body to produce its own HGH. There’s some concerns re: sources of external HGH.

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#174

My best guess would be less side effects due to off target stuff. Also, my guess is that you might not have insulin resistance if you use the other secretagogues

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#175

Chinese recombinant HGH is nominally $1/IU ($0.6-1.2ish) but causes more water retention than brand name. It will raise your IGF-1 quite a bit though.

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#176

But one only has to do it once for a limited treatment window every two decades or something like that? Not an ongoing thing if I understand it correctly.

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#177

Every 5 years, from what I understand

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#178

What biomarkers are you measuring?

#179

Yes, obviously the science is undecided on this but Fahy suggests it’s something you need to do every dozen years or so.
" Because T cells live a dozen years or so, patients would only need to take a course that often. " Regenerating The Thymus: Profile Of Greg Fahy

If the protocol can be be reduced to 90 days - every 12 years …

One question I have - apart from insulin/blood sugar - what else does Fahy monitor?
What should we be monitoring if we take HGH or Sermorelin?

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#180

As a mechanical type person, this doesn’t make much sense to me.

Thymus involution starts at puberty. Lets say 13 years old. From what I’ve read, it’s completely involuted by the time we are 20 implying that the T-Cells my body is producing after 20 are not maturated. This would indicate that all the maturated T-Cells are gone by the time I’m 32 = 35 years of no Thymus support for my T-Cells.

The question for me is, when I stop supporting my Thymus, how long does it continue to function at an acceptable level?

  • There are two main types of T cells
  • T-cells are produced all the time, not in 12 year spurts…
  • T cells are born from hematopoietic stem cells, found in the bone marrow. Developing T cells then migrate to the thymus gland to develop (or mature).
  • New T-cells produced after Thymic involution are not “maturated” by the Thymus
  • T cell defects can present with organ specific autoimmune diseases

It seems to me that having a functioning Thymus throughout our lives would be beneficial to our T-Cell health and function. Which may then help prevent age related autoimmune diseases.

So I will continue to do the modified TRIIM protocol for the rest of my life or until I find a reason not to.

And I will also use TA-1 on a semi-regular basis for similar reasons.

The immune response of thymosin alpha 1 is due to its action in elevating the activity of T cell maturation into CD4+/CD8+ T cells. It works to directly activate natural killer cells as well as CD8+ T cells through which it kills virally infected cells.
Thymosin alpha 1: A comprehensive review of the literature - PMC

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#181

I understand the desire to switch from HGH to secretagogues like ipamorelin (lower cost, pulsatile secretion, etc.), but why are people substituting SGLT2i for metformin? Yes, both will lower blood sugar, but metformin more directly opposes the enhanced hepatic glucose output from increased GH levels. Metformin is also cheaper, has few side effects for most people, and is more easily obtained. There is also no evidence to support the epigenetic benefits of a protocol with SGLT2i vs. metformin. These drugs are very different in terms of target tissues, mechanism of action, etc.

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#182

Using a GLP1 agonist is also a good choice if the goal is to control hepatic glucose production. Cost and access could be an issue, but if you have access to exotic things like ipamorelin, then you likely have access to tirzepatide, and likely at a really reasonable cost.

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#183

I think all other things equal, HGH is better option than the secretagogues. If you are the kind of person who refuses to take anything that wasn’t prescribed, then it’s virtually impossible to get HGH.

The underground market is king for HGH and it’s much cheaper than it used to be years ago, unless one refuses to use anything other than Serostim (which is prescription grade).

If HGH was often prescribed, no one would even think about the secretagogues. Their existence only stems from the fact you can’t get an HGH prescription anywhere, and even if you do (you may have a shot if you have AIDS), the price is so high from the pharmacy that it’s completely disqualifying.

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