I would think twice about HGH for longevity… as it seems to be counterproductive in the long term if you persistently raise GH levels. But I suspect most people are not going to do this (i.e. not do supplemental HGH for decades). Also, if you are a low risk of cancer (i.e. never smoked, lower BMI, no history of diabetes, etc.) then that would probably lower concerns about cancer (if there is a small increased risk, which may or may not be the case).
I haven’t done the research into the benefits much in aging - and with anything you need to look at the cost/benefit analysis. We have a few people on these forums with experience using HGH I think. Perhaps anyone who has tried HGH can comment on the perceived benefits?
The issue of whether you are deficient is an interesting case. I’m not sure what the issues / negatives are that people experience with lower than normal GH / IGF1 levels. Are they something you notice day to day? Wound healing slower? Muscle recovery and growth slower? What do you notice?
@LukeMV have you tried HGH? Any experiences you can share? Anyone else?
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Jonas
#29
how do we interpret the ratio? what are the basis for that or research paper?
There are many similar articles.
Having a solid T cell immunity is important to not becoming really unwell with viral infections and also having your body recognize malignancies.
We have done HGH at physiologic levels and our IGF 1 didn’t get stimulated.
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The Levine spreadsheet formula considers lower White Blood Cell counts pro longevity. I have been leukopenic for some time with a WBC around 3.8 (E9 per litre). I haven’t managed to work out why this is. I know my CRP is unusually low (below 0.15mg/L). It is not infection related as it does drop even lower when I have had an infection. The lowest I have is 2.32
My N:L ratio is normally about 3.5:1 which looks in the paper to be high although it has been under 2:1.
It strikes me there is something interesting in the issues behind WBC counts and Lymphocyte numbers, but I don’t know what it is.
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LukeMV
#32
Yes I’ve used it. I came from the bodybuilding world and had some health scares, which led me to being so interested in health and eventually longevity (which clearly worsen with bodybuilding).
I took it in large doses that are definitely unsafe but also used very low doses.
At the low doses, I notice minor physique changes
Large doses clearly bring side effects like carpal tunnel, high resting heart rate, and bloating.
I’m actually on 1.5IU per day right now. I go on and off of it. I talk to a lot of people who take or have taken it at all kinds of doses.
I admit I might have a little bias here due to my experience with it.
I appreciate your points on the matter. I think this whole topic is still very much up for debate.
I also think the thought of taking it temporarily and then stopping (as you and @Neo both pointed out) makes sense as well, since the subjects in the original TRIIM trial still had benefits after discontinuation.
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LukeMV
#33
I just got this email newsletter
“Preliminary Results from TRIIM-XA Confirm and Extend the Main Results of TRIIM
The first phase of the confirmatory TRIIM-X trial, TRIIM-XA, has been completed, and several preliminary results are now in. For example, we were able to confirm significant (<0.01 to <0.001) declines in inflammation as indicated by C-reactive protein (CRP) levels as well as increased freshly-minted T cells (RTEs, p<0.01), and increases in total lymphocyte numbers in treated but not in control volunteers. Furthermore, six epigenetic aging clocks (our original four plus the Skin&Blood Age and the FitAge clocks) all ran in reverse with statistical significance over the course of our observation period, and two volunteers who participated both in TRIIM and in TRIIM-XA ended TRIIM-XA with plasma PhenoAges no greater than they had been, or substantially less than they had been, when they first entered the TRIIM trial about 7-8 years earlier. In addition, new effects have been statistically demonstrated, including fat loss (e.g., a major loss of visceral adipose tissue with p<0.001), gains in lean body mass, increased strength, and highly significant gains in cardiovascular and aerobic fitness that are known to positively correlate with reduced future morbidity and mortality. So far, so good, and we learned some very interesting things in TRIIM-XA that will hopefully make the results of TRIIM-XB, now in progress, even better!“
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That is very interesting. Thank you.
LukeMV
#35
My IGF1 is also the same at a dose of 1.5iu before bed as it was at baseline. If I increase, then I see IGF1 start to go up.
To be fair, my IGF1 at baseline is higher than most since the TRT I am on bumps it up
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LukeMV
#36
Another big misconception is that HGH causes cancer. If this were the case, then we would be seeing bodybuilders getting cancer left and right. We don’t see this at all amongst the bodybuilding community. Heart and kidney disease, yes. Cancer, no.
Growth hormone replacement therapy reduces risk of cancer in adult with growth hormone deficiency: A meta-analysis - PMC (nih.gov)
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There seems to be conflicting information in this area.
As I’ve mentioned elsewhere in these forums, there is a genetic condition called Laron syndrome (LS), also known as growth hormone insensitivity or growth hormone receptor deficiency (GHRD). In these people their bodies GH receptors are basically inoperable, so they are unable to take up and use growth hormone that is circulating in their bodies.
The result is that they are tiny (about 4 ft tall on average), but never (or only extremely rarely, even when they are smokers) get cancer and they all live a long time…
Of course, there is a wide range of dosing of growth hormone here, from lifelong GH uptake of near zero in the case of the Laron syndrome people, to normal levels, to super physiological levels for shorter periods of time.
Cancer and diabetes
It has been reported that people with LS in Ecuador are resistant to cancer and diabetes and are somewhat protected against aging.[26][27][28] This is consistent with findings in mice with a defective growth hormone receptor gene.[20] Among the approximately 100 individuals in this population, there were no reported cases of diabetes and one case of cancer.[29]
A 2019 study of individuals with isolated growth hormone deficiency (IGHD type 1B) in Itabaianinha County, Brazil demonstrated a phenotype consistent with Laron syndrome.[30] Researchers found that these humans had similarly extended healthspan, with resistance to cancer and attenuated effects of aging, but neither patients with LS nor IGHD experienced an increase in their overall lifespan.[30]
Also - read this thread: Another (likely) Longevity Drug - Somavert / Pegvisomant
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LukeMV
#38
I’m going to add a non evidence based response but just from my years being involved in the bodybuilding community and knowing all about PED/HGH use among bodybuilders, cancer is just not something we really see much of, despite high IGF1 levels as a result of supra-physiological doses of HGH. I’m talking about much more than 1-2iu here too. The real concern with there is heart growth and insulin resistance, but not cancer. My theory is that resistance training is one of the most anti-cancer things someone can do so that probably helps offset any kind of cancer risk, if it even exists in the first place.
I get that dwarves don’t get cancer, but I don’t think they are the end all, be all, to the debate. It’s not like they live very long lives.
7 Likes
Senben
#39
Hi!
I would like to know does HGH promotes sex hormones production in woman and man?
Is it possible by using HGH to have more youtfull levels of estradiol and progesteron in womam and testosteron in man?
Thank you
I have been on a good thymus rejuvenation dose of peptide HGH for about 3 months. Skin looks fantastic… face… neck… arms and belly. General feeling is great.
On that note: I have had noticeable increased joint popping… in elbows… knees… not a negative thing. Actually a release and comfort.
Those area feel tight… will extend and get that pop of gases in the synovial joint fluid.
I think this is a healthy sign… as I am more flexible lately too. No joint pain after working out. No recovery. Arms and chest swole 
… and hard. Gained about 10 pounds of muscle… at 192 -194 pounds now. Workouts are easy. So all is great.
Any thoughts on increased popping?
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LukeMV
#41
I get some of that with my hands. A little carpal tunnel is a common side effect. What’s your dosing regimen?
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Exactly… I get a little stiffness in wrist too. Pretty minor.
It is suppose to affect bone health… and bone growth… since starting over the past 3 months… I have noticed my teeth’s bite seems a bit out of alignment.
Not sure if there could be some jaw bone growth that is causing a slight change in my bite.
Bite is more to the front not on my back teeth. Just an observation.
I am doing 3 iu daily for thymus regeneration… will do for 6 more months… 9 months total.
Going to do my Gylcan testing for inflammation and methylation dna test in a few weeks. See how hgh has affected biological age.
Based on Dr. Fahy’s trials… should gain back 3 to 5 years… on top of the rapamycin benefits. Hopefully.
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LukeMV
#43
Are you noticing any changes in your physique other than better skin? Or water retention?
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Hey Luke,
Yes… great improvements on skin quality on neck, forearms… tight stomach and chest.
Gained some hard muscle (definitely the TRT and HGH combo). Biceps are firm… lifting a lot easier at gym.
Areas like valley between my pecs… was a bit boney… has filled up… fleshed out. Gained 10 pounds of solid mass… also seems to be shredding what little bit of fat is left.
Euphoria and feeling clear headed and great.
Hopefully my thymus is repairing… will do biological tests in a few more weeks. Excited to see if I improved my inflammation and methylation… which already are great.
Thinking a course of HGH is another good choice… like TRT and rapamycin.
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A few more things.
I gained probably water weight at first… went up to 201 pounds for a week. But, that leveled down to 191 to 192… currently. Have to say was fun being a 200+ big boy… even for a week. But, truth be told prefer the 192 pounds. Feels better.
So that first 2 weeks could feel the hgh acting in my heart… especially on my workout days. Very heavy… full feeling in the heart… by week 3 that feeling was gone.
Interestingly… the same feeling happened when I started rapamycin those first 3 weeks.That was 4 1/2 years ago. You don’t forget that feeling. Lol. Why I didn’t worry. I think my heart was repairing.
Also, took the first 9 shots alternating (left… then right) to stomach. Got hot, hard lumps… switched to my butt. Alternating cheeks. Was initially hard and hot… fevered… then stopped having any reaction. Shot and nothing. My body was adapting. Past month and a half no reaction to shots at all. Can’t tell which side got the shot.
Feeling amazing… but felt I should give a heads up on my initial body responses.
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Jjazz
#46
My interpretation of the GH data in longevity is that increased IGF1 and GH are primarily detrimental for longevity due to their negative impacts on insulin sensitivity. There may also be some additional negative impacts during development (as supported by mouse studies), but these are irrelevant unless you are an adolescent or younger.
There can also be a big positive impact from IGF1 on thymus regeneration, as shown in TRIIM and TRIIM-X. Regenerating your thymus could be hugely impactful for longevity, at least as much as rapa. In addition to restarting production of naive T-cells (important for immunity to things you weren’t exposed to as a child), TRIIM also showed a large decrease in circulating CD38+ monocytes. CD38 is one of the primary cellular degraders of NAD+. Thus, restoration of NAD+ levels could be one of the primary reasons why TRIIM showed a decrease in epigenetic age.
So, how do you put it all together? You do what TRIIM did. Take GH or a secretagogue to boost IGF1 levels and regrow your thymus. This takes about a year. Concurrently take metformin/DHEA to mitigate the negative effects on insulin sensitivity. This can help you get the benefits without the downsides. At the end of the year, stop, and work on improving your insulin sensitivity, activating autophagy, etc. Get back to other longevity interventions.
Also, if you are trying to regrow your thymus, don’t take rapa during TRIIM or a TRIIM-like protocol. Rapamycin has potent effects on thymocytes that work against the proliferative effects you are aiming for with TRIIM. You can take rapa when you are done with the 12 month protocol.
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Hey Jon… thanks for your additional insights on Thymus rejuvenation. My TRIIM-like protocol. In several YouTube videos, Dr. Fahy gives pretty easy instructions on what to do. I am under the care of my personal physician.
And yes, as a precaution - I have been taking DHEA with my nightly shot. No insulin issues finishing 3 months of dosing.
Taking two 50 mg pills.
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