#19

Any extra investment in figuring out how to extend human lifespans is a positive in my book, no matter who is doing the research.

The field could also do with some new ideas, and the Russians may identify different approaches that haven’t been explored yet.

No doubt they (like others) will run into plenty of dead-ends; but the big breakthroughs will only come from exloring new avenues rather than just from perfecting things like rapamycin and its analogues.

I just hope they are taking it seriously. If you believe the article, the aspiration to extend Russian’s lifespans isn’t yet backed up with the massive funding that such an undertaking will need.

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#20

You are assuming that they will actually do some research on this. But odds are absolutely nothing will happen. It’s an empty propaganda exercise with nothing behind it. I doubt there’s a single rubel or kopeck of funding behind it, and if there is it’ll disappear into some deep pockets never to be heard from again. The person behind this project is a Putin crony who is not only trying to butter up Putin, but who is himself completely insane, and a well known crank who believes in the “Russian genome” - he’s a madman. From the article:

"Mikhail Kovalchuk a physicist and member of an elite group close to Putin, is reported to have lobbied for the project. He “raves about eternal life and the ‘Russian genome,’” a Kremlin source said.

Folks, there is no reality behind this. This is a poor man’s Lysenkoism of the Russian Genome crankery, and old tradition in Russia:

Lysenkoism - Wikipedia.

Have you actually read this newsweek article? Here’s the funding:

“A source close to the Kremlin told the publications that the government lacks the funding for a project of this scale.”

“All the modern research discussed in the national project is quite expensive - it requires a lot of money and expenses. The development of new drugs costs billions, no national project can handle it, especially now,” the source said. “I don’t think they will be able to put together anything meaningful quickly.”

Do you know how much thought went into this?

"One Russian doctor who received the letter in June said they were surprised that physicians were asked to work on the proposals with such urgency.

“We were asked to urgently send all our developments, and the letter arrived, let’s say, today, but everything had to be sent yesterday. To be honest, this is the first time in my life that I’ve encountered this - usually any national project or FTP [federal target program] is preceded by a series of meetings with the participation of various specialists, some kind of public discussion,” the doctor said."

There is no reality behind this, it’s really a joke on the Nigerian Prince email level and anyone who thinks any actual research will happen, may as well look for millions in his account thanks to a lost Prince from Africa.

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#21

lol. if you actually read my last paragraph, you will see that I not assuming anything, whereas you are assuming quite a lot.

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#22

Really, we’re going to do this? OK:

On the contrary it does matter who does the research. A creationist who does “research” on evolution by studying the bible brings zero value to the field. This Russian announcement is from someone who is the euivalent in biology of creationism, as he believes in a distinct “Russian genome” - this has as little value as the Lysenkoism that destroyed Soviet genetic research for decades.

“The field could also do with some new ideas, and the Russians may identify different approaches that haven’t been explored yet.”

The Russians will identify no approaches, let alone different ones, as this proposal is just empty words with zero behind it. Would you also say that “we could do with some different sources of money” in response to an article about a Nigerian Prince scam email? It makes as little sense. Nobody would even dignify either with any speculation as to the funds from the email scam or results from this “research” that exists only as a press release.

“No doubt they (like others) will run into plenty of dead-ends; but the big breakthroughs will only come from exloring new avenues rather than just from perfecting things like rapamycin and its analogues.”

Clearly - with your own words - you are in fact postulating that “they” (Russians) might run into dead ends - but that clearly, CLEARLY assumes that they will do research, otherwise how can they run into dead ends. But there will be no research. You are only ASSUMING there will be research. There won’t. The Nigerian Prince is not sending money, and in fact there is no Nigerian Prince. There is not and will not be any research, dead end or otherwise as a result of this press release.

“I just hope they are taking it seriously.” Would you also hope the Nigerian Prince has funds to send you? This is about as reasonable a hope. There is ZERO chance that anyone in Russia is taking this seriously. The sole reality of this project is as a press release, or Nigerian email scam.

“If you believe the article, the aspiration to extend Russian’s lifespans isn’t yet backed up with the massive funding that such an undertaking will need.”

The “aspiration” isn’t “yet” backed up, in the same way the Nigerian Princes email is not “yet” backed by millions of dollars about to flow to your bank account. There is no “yet”. There is only “lol, never”. The very use of the word “yet” assumes there is a possibility that there will be funding for this wild project. There is no such possibility - just as there is no possibility that the Nigerian Prince has millions for you… in fact, the Nigerian Prince doesn’t exist, just as this project doesn’t exist except as an email in one case and an empty press release in the other.

And now I’m done with this topic, because just as in the case of the Nigerian Prince scam emails, some folks will always, always believe in that reality no matter what anyone else says. Good luck with the Russian cure for aging.

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#23

Amen to that, now hopefully on to productive posts not ideological rants

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#24

Yes they developed Sputnik and most people in the world didn’t want it. I remember I was in Turkey and Sputnik and Pfizer were available (maybe also Moderna) and people were avoiding Sputnik as much as possible :joy: It might just be marketing.

But Wikipedia says 2.5% of the world’s population was vaccinated with it: so I was too harsh, that’s a success.

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#25

I judge initiatives by outcomes, not press release, money invested or intentions. It’s good to have new initiatives. The more the merrier. But let’s be realistic: they might not move the needle much.

#26

A good article on the initiative btw: Who wants to live forever? Inside the Russian authorities’ plan to develop anti-aging technology — even as they keep sending soldiers to die in droves — Meduza

As they say: Умом — Россию не понять…

#27

I don’t think I’ve ever read such a sustained string of ethnically based hate and invective on this forum.
There are some people here (me included) who have deep connections with Russia. You should be ashamed of yourself.

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#28

Let’s stay civilized and only discuss the main topic. Otherwise we might have to close this thread. We’re all here to reach common goals of healthspan and lifespan. More science, less politics.

@DrT: I don’t think there’s ethnically-based hate here. (Or at least I hope so and that’s not how I read the message). Even more so as in English we don’t have the difference between русский and российский: The ethnicity and the citizenship. It’s okay to criticize the Russian government (or any government). And it’s okay to say that not much good quality academic research has come out of Russia recently. (On the other hand, there are many brilliant Russian scientists in non Russian institutions, same for China, Brazil, and Iran btw ). It’s also a fact that all around the world most big government announcements for mega projects often end up in nothing (“white elephants”). So it’s normal to be skeptical of this new Russian project.

[EDIT: one post was actually problematic and therefore removed.]

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#29

I’m being civil. I can’t say the same about others.
And there are/were broad-brush comments directed at Russians as a people.

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#30

I thought you might have thought about retracting this, too. Clearly inaccurate.

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#31

I commented on this here: Russian scientists told to develop cure for aging: reports - #24 by adssx (still not a “massive success” btw, but fairly irrelevant anyway, let’s stick to the main topic)

#32

The only enemy Russia has is within itself, not people on a forum, it’s not possible to do any scientific advancements while they are standing in the way. Think about it carefully and why it’s in a decline, and who knows how things will be in 10 years…

Here’s a good video for all the Russians in Russia and abroad! :nesting_dolls: :hand_with_index_finger_and_thumb_crossed:

1 Like
#33

You did not attach the disclaimer, brought to you by propaganda master; The Center Intelligence Agency

#34

Yes, that’s correct.

#35

Ok everyone let’s remember to stay on topic here. Identifying problems with a country’s research is a lot different from criticizing a whole nationality.

Remember to go easy on the people but hard on the science. :slight_smile:

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#36

A lot of Russian longevity scientists will be found dead in the next decade.

#37

Please explain the logic behind such an asinine statement. Oh and evidence to back it up….if you have any.

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#38

They can’t deliver and get suicided. The evidence for that can be found in the Ukrainian biolabs which definitely exist according to Russian media.